Transcript: 3 Practical Keys to Make Your Strategy and Leadership Sustainable // Jos Snoep, Bible League International

The Flourishing Culture Podcast Series

“3 Practical Keys to Make Your Strategy and Leadership Sustainable“

March 28, 2022

Jos Snoep

Intro: Do you think about improving the effectiveness of your organization by engaging your employees and discussion groups? Well, in today's episode we talk about approaches to help inspire your employees by connecting vision to their work. Listen in as we discuss practical ways to be sure your strategy and leadership are sustainable.

Al Lopus: Hi, I'm Al Lopus, and you're listening to the Flourishing Culture Podcast, where we help you create a flourishing workplace. The problem employers are facing today is that more of our employees are quitting than ever before. Some people are calling this the great resignation. And now with millions of open jobs, how can churches, Christian non-profits, and Christian-owned businesses face this tidal wave of resignations while attracting new, outstanding talent? And we know that having a flourishing workplace with fully engaged employees is the solution. I'll be your guide today as we talk with a thought leader about key steps that you can take to create a flourishing workplace culture.

So, now let's meet today's special guest.

Flourishing organizations have a sustainable strategy, and for the strategy to be sustainable, it needs to be threaded throughout your organization. Strategy isn't just for your executive team but should be embraced by everyone. How do you lead in a way that equips and empowers your teams to carry out the vision and mission of your ministry in your everyday work? Well, we'll address that topic in today's podcast.

I'm delighted to welcome back Jos Snoep, the president and CEO of the Bible League International. Jos began his ministry with Bible League International in the Netherlands in 2005—you might recognize an accent here—and he served in various leadership roles before assuming the position of president several years ago.

Jos, it’s great to be back with you again, and welcome back to the Flourishing Culture Podcast.

Jos Snoep: Yeah, thanks, Al. It’s good to be back. And it’s impossible to hide the accent, so you have to learn to live with it, I guess. But we appreciate this time and appreciate the partnership with Best Christian Workplace Institute.

Al: Oh, thanks. We love working with you.

So, Jos, before we dive into this important topic of leadership and strategy, remind our listeners about the vision and mission of Bible League International and your impact in spreading the Good News around the world.

Jos: Sure, yeah. Our vision is fairly simple. It's to engage everyone in God's Word, and we do that by providing Bibles and training to under-resourced churches around the world. And it's really about serving the churches that partner in the mission of God, the churches that are called to be part of the Great Commission, which, really, they all are. But they have, you know, it's hard for them to have access to Bibles, to materials, to study materials. It's hard for them to have access to training. Those are the churches we seek to help and come alongside. And, really, the impact of our ministry is life change. It's people coming to Christ. It's people growing as witnesses of Christ, and as a result of that, communal transformation, you know, through brothers and sisters living together in faith in their community.

Al: Yeah. Brothers and sisters living together, that kind of describes the workplace, doesn’t it?

Jos: That’s right.

Al: And I love you’re partnering in the mission of God. Absolutely.

Well, at Best Christian Workplaces Institute, we talk about sustainable strategy and what happens when a sound strategy is embedded in an organization's culture. And it's how an organization accomplishes its mission, we know. Bible League International is known for having a sustainable strategy, and that's part of the purpose of our podcast today. What are some of the ways that you equip and release your people and teams for sustainable strategy to accomplish your mission?

Jos: Yeah. Thanks for asking that, and it's really an exciting topic. It's also an incredibly big topic.

Al: Yeah, it is.

Jos: Sustainable strategy, it's definitely something we work for. And I also think there's a realization that there needs to be a humility about the fact that you're never going to be perfect and it is a work in progress. I think that is a really important aspect of it.

But one of the things that is really important for us is to help people understand really what they are part of. I don't think people are motivated by rules or by tasks or necessarily even by goals that you set for them. But people are motivated by vision. And so as an organization, we really try to provide opportunity, provide the ability for everybody that is part of this organization to know the mission, to know the vision.

And one of the things that we do is to connect the vision to the strategic themes in our organization is something we call mission-vision meetings. And what are mission-vision meetings? They are really opportunities for staff to come together in small groups and to engage in, okay, what is this mission? What is this vision? What does this mean for us collectively? What does it mean for us individually? And they’re really times where I, as a CEO, sit together with our staff in small groups, and I take deliberate time to talk with staff members over maybe a two-hour session. It's really not me presenting all the time. It's really talking, you know, having a conversation. That's one of the things that we do to have a sustainable strategy.

The second point I think attached to that is to really create a culture where people feel part of the mission and the vision. They know what the values are. They know the philosophies of how we want to work together and to really create that space for people to be, you know, to be part of that, to be able to collaborate, innovate, to be empowered to make decisions. So that is a very big part of our sustainable strategy.

And, then, a third aspect is making sure that people have opportunity to be trained, you know, in the vision and in the mission; and how their role contributes to that by opportunities for cross-training; opportunities for collaboration; opportunities for training, managers’ training, leadership training, training and expertise; and be very intentional about that.

Al: Gosh, I love it. Three strategies connecting vision to strategic themes and small groups: having actual conversations about that, connecting the culture based on values, and then making sure people are trained in the culture and professional growth that lead to culture building. Yeah.

Jos: Yeah. You know what is excited about that? The mission and vision meetings are an opportunity for me to sit with every single employee in the organization to talk about the big picture. And I have a great example of an employee that works in one of our partner-services areas, and she's normally not engaged in project work. But as we were talking about our vision for children ministry, she flourished up in the meeting. And I was walking out of the meeting, and she was walking next to me, and she asked a question afterwards, “Hey, if there's ever any opportunity for me to engage in a project around children, I might want to be considered.” And I was like, wow, that is cool. That is a great example of how connecting the vision to people really empowers them. And she was the one asking the question. That was super cool.

Al: That’s fantastic. That kind of engagement, those conversations build trust, and it sounds like—we know there's a high level of trust between you and those you work with and amongst the leaders and the staff.

So, when you're bringing on a new leader or promoting someone to a new role, how do you make sure that there’s a good fit with the culture that you've got there at Bible League International?

Jos: Yeah. First of all, that is also an area where, you know, humility is in place and constant improvement in structuring that in a better way. And we're actually partnering with you guys on that, as we speak. But I think it begins, really, with having a consistent message and a consistent way of working and developing our culture overall. And that includes everybody, not just the leaders, because eventually you hope that your leaders are going to grow out of your organization, out of your culture, and by the time they become leaders, they have already been immersed in the culture, and they already understand the values and philosophy. So I think it's really important to have consistency about that for everybody and really clarifying expectations about, you know, what the values of the organizations are and the philosophies.

And so when we hire leaders from the outside, I think a big part of our recruitment process focuses on this aspect as well. So our H.R. team is very, very well versed in understanding our culture. They focus a lot of their time in the interview with the individual on spiritual growth, on culture, and on how people look at that as they are considering coming on board. So that's been a great way of helping the expectation to be there for new leaders.

And then as well in job descriptions and performance profiles, setting expectations for our leaders, there is a lot of emphasis on the cultural side.

Al: You know, we look back at Bible League International starting in 1938. You've been around for a while now, and as a leader, you're stewarding an organization that's more than 80 years old. What are some timeless principles that you hold onto as you guide the organization? And you know, where do you see the need to adapt and change to lead into the future as we go forward?

Jos: Hm. The history of the organization is something we very much value. You know, there's an appreciation of what God has done through our history. And we did an exercise a couple of years ago, when we celebrated our 80th anniversary, and we looked back at our history book. We have a little book called Story Without an End that tells the story of how this ministry started and developed. And as we were going through that history, we really recognized some values and how God has been working through this ministry. And we kind of distilled our values out of that story and realized, wow, these values are timeless. And so these values are prayer, calling, service, unity, integrity, and vision.

And to speak to the first two, prayer and calling, our history book talks about our founder, who was sick, and then somebody came and prayed over him. And it was that prayer that really seeded a calling into his life. His name was Bill Chipman. And at that time, he dedicated his life to the Lord. He basically said, if I get out of this, I am going to dedicate my life to the Lord’s ministry. So you see in this story the whole value of prayer and how the ministry started. And then calling. There's the sense that this is God's work, and He calls us to partner with Him.  So those two values are still there today, and that's how we try to be consistent in that.

And of course, methods change. In the last two years with the pandemic, we've seen a lot of our methods change, but we've also tried to keep those values present. So again, back to prayer, as kind of our first and core value of how this ministry started, was very important as we started to change our way of working during the pandemic, because we, basically, said prayer is still really important, and we want to make sure that with people working from home, that prayer is still very intentional and being practiced in this organization. So we came up with different solutions to do that and to facilitate that in the organization. So values stay, methods change, but they lead us in that change.

Al: Gosh, I love that. Yeah. Values stay, methods change; and don't confuse the two, right?

Jos: Mm-hmm.

Al: That's, yeah.

Jos, we've talked in the past about the fact that you don't like to make executive decisions, not that you're afraid to make decisions, but you purposely want to process where you guide decision making. Share with us some examples of how this style of decision making is effective in employee engagement, particularly. I love this example.

Jos: Yeah. I think that if people want to be heard and they want to be part of something, they want to be part of the solution, and they will be part of the solution if you truly listen to them and engage with them and allow decision making to happen in the community rather than top-down from a leader. And last year, we introduced a whole new approach in our organization to both employee engagement and partner engagement. We introduced a system where, basically, on a quarterly basis, we sit down intentionally with either the employee, but we also do it with our partners globally. We're looking at, what happened in the last three months? How has your work been going? What have you seen? What are some of your goals? How have you seen God working through what you have done in your ministry here at Bible League? And then in the same conversations, we look forward to the next three months. So reflecting on the last three months. Now what does that mean for the next three months? And where do we have to pivot? Where do we have to allocate resources? So there's this agility that has come into decision making with both our employees and our partners. And it's really an opportunity to learn quicker, to truly listen on a more regular base, instead of, you know, a whole year planned out or more executive decisions. No, it looks at every part of the organization, and it facilitates learning and listening on a more frequent base. So it's really exciting to see, you know, what comes out of that and how people feel valued through this whole exercise.

Al: I trust you’re enjoying our podcast today. We’ll be right back after an important word for leaders.

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Al: And now, back to today’s special guest.

Yeah, I like what you say: facilitating, learning, and listening, and how that is helpful. I love the idea, Jos, that you're going through the same process for your employees as you do with your partners. So that's a consistency in your brand, if you will, that starting with your employees, that impacts also going through the same process with your partners; and you're learning, you're listening, and increasing engagement both with employees and your partners. Oh, that's great. Wow.

Jos: Yeah. Yeah. It’s really exciting. And I think part of this thinking originated from the pandemic because we realized all our plans for the long term are suddenly out of the door.

Al: Yeah.

Jos: So how do you work in an environment where you stick to your values and you stick to your mission and vision, but you have more agility around your decisions and your methods? And this process facilitates that better.

Al: You know, so that kind of decision making is really about releasing control. But what would you say to a leader or another organization who's listening to this now and they’re struggling with the idea of releasing control or wondering how to move in that kind of direction that you've just talked about?

Jos: Yeah. And again, it's a topic to approach with constant correction and humility as well. And I think that's why this is very much a formation process, a spiritual formation process, actually. I think, ultimately, this is rooted in the trust in God, realizing that we can't control everything and that we are called to be stewards of what God is giving to us. So it really is about Him becoming more and me becoming less and truly serving people.

And it sounds maybe a little heavy, but I absolutely think that is the core of it, because if you think about, you know, leadership, there is always the dynamic of power, and power is hard to manage. History proves that. And naturally, through human nature, power finds its way through control and fear and trying to manage that. I think supernaturally power tries to find its way in serving God and serving people and creating freedom and creating empowerment. And so knowing that it's something supernaturally, we just know we need God to work through us in order to do that.

So I think stewardship is really the key word there, too. Stewarding power and empowering others, realizing that everybody, every single person, in Bible League, in this case, has received talents and skills. Every single person is called by the Holy Spirit to participate in this calling. And as a leader, I need to respect that. I need to realize that God is calling all of us individually to be part of that.

So I ask myself questions once in a while, as a check and balance, I guess, on that is, can I truly rejoice in the success of others? Am I really listening to others? Am I able to ask questions to others rather than offer, you know, my suggestions or my solutions? And the last one that is maybe the hardest one is, do I truly love the people that I work with? I think those are all questions that kind of help me to stay sharp on that, to be transparent and accountable for my leadership.

Al: Those are great questions, Jos. I think of leaders, and I hope those that are listening wherever you are think of those questions. Can you answer those questions truthfully? You know, can you rejoice in the success of others, not in your own success, but in the success of others? Are you able to actually listen to others? Are you able to ask questions rather than offer suggestions? I mean, we find ourselves as leaders, so many times people are coming to us for our advice or suggestions, but actually allowing them to kind of discover the best way for themselves just based on the questions we ask. The bottom-line question: do we truly love the people we work with? because that makes a huge difference in just our countenance and the way we address others. I love those questions. Thank you. Thank you.

You lead an international organization with people from many different cultural backgrounds. And in my new book, Road to Flourishing, you said listening to people creates diversity in itself because it means different voices are coming to the table. It creates innovation because you have different perspectives from all around the globe. So as you bring voices to the table to share ideas, sometimes healthy conflicts can come out of those energetic discussions. And I always thought, historically I used to think, well, conflict as a negative thing. But healthy conflict is truly a positive one. Does your organization have some practices on how to handle healthy conflict when you're dealing with, you know, diverse ideas and cultural differences that could easily be misunderstood or taken personally?

Jos: Yeah. Yeah, we definitely have, to answer your question directly, we definitely have language about conflict management, you know, in our handbooks. And even in our agreements with partners, we specify process to follow in case of conflict. And you know, I think conflict can indeed be very helpful, but most of us are conflict avoiders. We don't like it. So we need guidance in how to handle that. And in some sort of way, I feel like I'm a constant learner on this too, because, you know, every conflict is different. Every conflict has other players, has a new situation. I kind of feel like I am never going to be perfect in conflict management because every single one is a new opportunity. You know, it's a new challenge.

Al: Right. Yeah. No, that’s exactly right.

Yeah. So you’ve got language about it, and again, both for employees, through policies and handbooks, and also with partners. So oftentimes you don't hear about your donors. Of course, having conflict processes, healthy conflict processes, helps you retain donors over a long period of time, just as it helps you retain your employees. Yeah.

Jos: Yeah. It's really setting that, again, back to culture and your values and the philosophy; how you want to work in your organization and creating a culture of transparency; the people, they dare to be transparent. You know, there's no retaliation or consequence if conflict is brought up, because when people do that, they encounter a listening attitude. And that's really, I think, important to create that safe atmosphere to be able to have conflict.

Another thing that we said here at Bible League was don't go too quickly into a statement “agree to disagree,” because to agree to disagree, most of the time, means that there is one winner and one loser. It also probably means you haven't spent enough time with each other to actually come to agreement. So invest in the relationship, invest in listening, and make sure you find that common ground together, because I think there is hardly any situation where you can't get a solution, and that is the opportunity that we want to create for people is there's always a way out.

Al: Yeah. Boy, that’s great advice. Invest in the relationship. And that takes time and listening and humility, is a word that you've used many times.

So, again, Bible League International makes the Word of God available to people around the world. And there's definitely a spiritual dimension to your leadership, Jos, and that comes through in our Engagement Survey. So how do you nurture your own relationship with God so that you can effectively lead and shepherd the people that God has entrusted to your leadership?

Jos: Yeah. I mean, the first one is just a relationship with God, is through prayer and through being in His Word. We're doing His work, so we need to be in tune with what His mission is and how we communicate that through His Word to us. And if we lose that connection, we might as well stop.

Al: Yeah.

Jos: So, you know, prayer and being in the Word of God. You know, I rejoice in being part of a local church community and having some accountability partners that I have breakfast with once in a while; and some of the questions I mentioned earlier, those are the questions I talk about with an accountability partner. For me, also, what works is conversation with peers, just talking with other leaders about, what are you experiencing, and how are you doing? So those are just a couple of things, that they're all part of that nurturing of a relationship with God and staying sound in your leadership.

Al: Yeah. This is a big issue for leaders. And I just finished a podcast with Jim Tomberlin. He talks about, you know, we can only bring what we have, and we want to finish well, and that's the challenge. And so these are great, great practices. You know, staying connected with God is key through prayer and studying the Word, local-church fellowship, accountability partners, podcasts with other leaders. You know, accountability partners really is a key. And then, peers outside of your organization. So leadership doesn't have to be a lonely venture with those kinds of relationships. That's fantastic.

Jos: Yeah. And it certainly is. And I work very closely, of course, with a board here. They are part of that accountability partner, too. But I'm very blessed with a board that is truly interested in my health and how I do with my family, and they ask questions about that. But they don't only ask questions; they're truly interested, and they facilitate that. And that's, so again, yeah, that's absolutely true. You're not alone. And your board, especially when you're an executive leader, plays a major role in that as well.

Al: Board that cares and demonstrates that caring, that's a good board. Yeah, absolutely. And that doesn't mean there isn’t accountability. But again, when you know they care, you're in a position to listen to their advice as well. Yeah.

Jos: Absolutely.

Al: Well, Jos, this has been just a great conversation. You know, there's so much more we could talk about. But I really like your three points on a sustainable strategy. And I love the idea, this is really good for our listeners, you know, to talk about strategy and your major themes and small groups and gather that input and listen and with humility, really understand how to connect your strategic themes with your vision in small groups. I love that idea. And thirdly, that people are trained in the culture and in building their own professional growth. That's really helpful. So I love how your history of 80 years, you've got a story without end. And you know, many of our ministries, God doesn't intend them to end, but we need to stay with the original calling and understand what the values have been and how the values stay, but the methods change. That's such an important lesson for each of us. I love your way about describing your leadership and how it's not top-down, but you have processes for decision making and both not only with your employees, but also your partners, and how you reflect on the last three months and talk about the next three months and how that engages people to walk with you into the future. Just a lot of great thoughts here.

Let me ask you, okay, so how about one final thought or a takeaway that you'd like to leave with our listeners?

Jos: Yeah. As I was listening to the summary, I just think about something I mentioned earlier, and that is that, you know, the Holy Spirit is at work, and He really calls people into His mission. And I think that is so important for leaders in ministry is to realize it's not just a collective or you as a leader who is called by the Holy Spirit. It's everybody that's called by the Holy Spirit. And you're just there to steward that and to facilitate that. And that makes it both an incredible opportunity and challenge. But it also gives a lot of rest because you know it's His, and you can trust that He is at work. And for me, that gives a lot of calm in how I can lead and how my stress levels are about, you know, about the ministry.

Al: Wow. That’s great.

Well, Jos, I want to thank you for your contributions today. And most of all, I appreciate your devotion to making the Word of God available in an understandable format to transform the lives of people around the world. That is such a valuable thing. So thank you for taking your time out today and speaking in the lives of so many listeners. Thank you.

Jos: Yeah, thanks, Al. Thanks for having me. We're looking forward to continuing partnering with you guys.

Al: We are, too. Thanks.

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